tosafos pesachim 106a brings two opinions whether kiddush on wine is deoraya, but all agree that he doesn't have to drink the wine. the 'rashi' here is the da'as ychid that implies there is a chiyuv to drink the wine. the sha'ages aryeh is ma'arich to push off the shita of rashi. maharatz chiyus also points out that the 'mushba v'omed' of kiddush would just be rov rivi'is or ma'aleh lugmav, but nazir is only violated with a full rivi'is and chatzi shiiur is not a violation ofthe nezirus even if it is assur m'doraysa? b'kitzur, there are many difficulties with 'rashi' both ithin the sugya (see orach mishor who elaborates to fit rashi in the gemara) and frm other places.
but, the last answer of tosafos in pesachim would still require wine m'doraysa, just that the torah doesn't require u to drink it. rosh here seems to undrstand that kiddush on 'something' is d'oraysa and u can't be yotzei in tefilla, rather you need wine or bread.
3 comments:
Isn't there a machlokes re: havdalah as well. the Rosh here says that it is only mdrabbana but I recall a RaMBaM that says havdalah is also a torah obligation.
i told over that this past fri night, i davened and made kidush in the middle of the night due to ..... so in my semicouncious state, i decided that i will have in mind to be יוצא the torah kidush in davening and only the derabanan kidush later since i was making kidush on challah (couldn't look at grape juice..), but according to this rosh i was mistaken... not sure what my logic was, but i thought since i'm not using wine i might as well do the deoraysa kidush quicker...
Yes, the rambam does say that havdala is d'oraysa, unlike the rosh here. m"b (296:1) brings the rambam that it is d'oraysa and then a yesh omrim (brought in magid mishna) that it is only d'rabonon. he doesn't mention that the rosh holds d'rabonon, but it does seem clear like that from the rosh.
regarding the issue of kiddush d'oraysa on "something", either wine or challah, i think that could be peshat in tosafos in pesachim also because if m'doraysa we require wine, how can the gemara speak about kiddush on challah. Another possibility is that the rosh holds that m'doraysa you don't need wine or challah for kiddush, but the rosh is simply proving that wine can't be a necessity because you can make kiddush on challa, but it could be that m'doraysa we don't require either wine or challah.
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