Wednesday, April 25, 2007

Chagiga 19a - Being Machzik while still in the Mikvah

Continuing with R' Yossi's last point on the previous post:
It seems that the din of machzik is not like the din of mitzvos trichos kavana. One can be machzik so long as he has not completely left the mikva, even though he is no longer immersed in the mikvah. This is clear bec. when someone came up but his leg is still in the mikvah, although regarding the water we consider the water on his body attached to be mashlim the mikvah, and perhaps (if you say gud asik) the water in the mikvah to be attached to his head to allow tevila in his hair, we cannot consider him to be immersed in the mikvah (since there are definitely parts of his body that are dry), yet he can still be machzik since he has not completely left the mikva. The rationale must be (as R' Yossi pointed out) that he must accept a level of shemirah before he leaves the mikvah, but does not have to be tovel with kavana as he would have to do a mitzvah with kavana.


Anonymous said...

Two quick points:
1. The Meiri says that that even if he was totally dry he can still be machzik.
2. Turei Even says it works me'din breira. Since he was tovel stam, when he later is machzik himself, we say huvrar hadavar lemafreah that his tevilah was al daas cein. (For the Meiri you have to say like the T"E.)

The problem is that since the basis for huchzak is that we are concerned that if he was tovel for kal he wasn't careful for chamur, then if he was tovel stam we should still be concerned that he wasn't tovel for chamur and not trust him until he makes up his mind. How can breira make it that in the interim he was careful for chamur? (unless you say that ain hachy namei, we wouldn't trust him lemafreah, just mecan ulhabaah.)

Avi Lebowitz said...

you are speaking about being machzik when he did not previously decide anything. under those circumstances the gemara is clear that you can be machzik even after leaving the mikava. tosafos points out that you can be machzik so long as you are still wet, and you are quoting from the meiri that even after you dry you can also be machzik. However, in my post i was speaking about the connection to r' yehuda that one who was already machzik for ma'aser can change and be machzik for teruma so long as their leg is still in the mikvah. if they completely leave the mikvah they can no longer be machzik. the question still is, how is this connected to r' yehuda. r' yehuda simply says that the water on his body is considered to be in the mikva so long as the water on his body is attached to the mikvah, but the din of changing what he is machzik for he must still have part of his body actually in the mikvah?